Right turns... why so hard?

[nighthawk700]

Before I got my Nomad a few months ago, I had a Kawasaki Concours for 10 years. Before that, a Honda Nighthawk 700 for 2 years. On those bikes, I never had turning problems. My left turns were always easier than right, but I managed fine either way.

However, with the Nomad, I'm really having problems with right turns, especially turns from a stop. I'm swinging out pretty wide, close at times to on coming traffic. It's getting so I try to plan a route with as little right turns as possible. When coming home today, I was at a light, and I could have turned right on red, but didn't do so because there was a lot of traffic in the second lane of the road (the right lane was a turn only just before the intersection, so was perfectly clear when I was there) and I was afraid of swinging out too far. I'm sure it's mostly a mental thing, and I've been practicing and all (making right turns in an empty parking lot), but it's not getting better. The only other thing I could think of is that the handle bars are different than the type I used on the Concours. I do plan on getting Phat II risers to bring them closer to me, but now I'm wondering, it practically touches me when I'm turning right as it is, if the risers being them back further, does that make the turns even more difficult?

So have others had this issue? How did you overcome it?

I want to be able to go out and enjoy, and not have to worry about my next right turn.

Thanks

[ells]

Just going to take a wild guess here - Because you are used to getting on and off the bike with it already leaning to the left??

[glwilson]

Nighthawk700;

While I would not claim to be an expert "rider"; I have a great teacher that had some great techniques. First of all; in America, the right turn is the tightest turn thus your bike has to be balanced both physically and with the trottle/clutch. So be sure to practice straight ahead movement from a dead stop until you "nail" the balance between the bike and trottle. "Nailed" means you do not wobble in the least -- your tire tracks perfectly straight ahead... no weaving in the slightest. (Police formation riding requires no movement off-track.)

Having said that; practice your turns by changing where your eyes are looking.

You will go where your eyes are looking -- thus look further out from your bike on into your turn further down the road to the right. Do not look immediately in front of your bike; nor directly at the traffic coming from the right -- otherwise you will go right towards it if you do.

Practice this in a parking lot multiple times while changing where you are looking. Start with large turns and looking 20+ feet out ahead of the bike. Once you have done this in various ways you will begin to see how it affects your control of the bike. You will eventually find a natural distance for your short-tight turns (somewhere near 15-20+ feet minimum).

By looking further out ahead of the bike your internal center of balance on the bike changes to a lower spot -- giving far more control in tight turns. This is especially important when making slower/tight turns.

Practice these two techniques and let me know how it works out for you. PS: If the handle bars are coming real close to your body in a right turn that is not good -- try to sit back in the seat as far as you can to avoid this if possible. You do not want to sit on top of the handlebars -- it changes your "control center of balance" on the bike. Good luck.

[scion0]

+1 Practice practice practice (once you think you got it -- go practice some more)... having said that... I am off to PRACTICE. :-)
Good luck.

[Cajunrider]

+1 Couldn't have said it better GL. Instincts say to look just ahead of the bike and to look at the ground. Instincts are wrong...Turn your head further to the right and only look where you want to go and the tight turns are so much easier to make. A little throttle and feather the clutch, even dragging the rear brake a little all stabilize the bike. Practice, practice, practice....

[joesnomad]

I also found that right hand turns were harder to master. The first problem I was having was my handle bar positioning. They seemed to low and on full lock or close to full lock turns my legs seemed to be in the way ther wasnt enough clearance with the bars the tank and legs. I purchased phat II risers although there are many other brands to choose from. After installation of them turns were easyer but still some what of a challenge someone had mentioned that were ever you head and eyes are looking your bike will follow. It seems weird but it works it takes alot of practice to make this come naturally. I need more practice because it still doesnt come naturally to me all the time but the old saying practice makes perfect sure makes a lot of sence in this situation. Another helpful thing is if you can get a copy of ride like a pro this guy is good and if you follow his instructions you will be amased at what you can acomplish.

[billmac]

Originally Posted by Cajunrider

+1 Couldn't have said it better GL. Instincts say to look just ahead of the bike and to look at the ground. Instincts are wrong...Turn your head further to the right and only look where you want to go and the tight turns are so much easier to make. A little throttle and feather the clutch, even dragging the rear brake a little all stabilize the bike. Practice, practice, practice....

I agree with terrebonnenomad.

The Nomad is heavy and longer requiring more expertise in tight turns. Dragging the rear brake, with some engine power will help keep the bike from falling to the inside. In tight turns from stop or slow speed, my bike leans into the turn, not my upper body. My head and shoulders stay up for balance and control.

Therefore on a tight slow right turn, I push the handlebars down to lean the bike and my tush is actually raised off the right side of the seat. Leaning into a tight turn without sufficient momentum/power is going to put me on the ground. Practicing slow tight turns, means throttle, rear brake, and clutch control. And most important, practicing proper rider posture. For stop/slow turns that means ensuring that I am not adding my body weight to the inside of the turn. Bad posture means I need lots of momentum/power and prayer to keep the tire from loosing traction. My 2 cents.

[dtrider]

Sounds like you're not alone. I have the same problem and have followed the advice given by the members and am slowly improving.
I also purchased the Ride like a Pro DVD and watched that. I don't
believe I will ever succeed in making those really tight turns but hopefully someday I will surprise myself. Now if I can only stop dropping my bike when parking it after trying to make a tight turn. I
just dropped it the other night while parking it on grass and I don't
think I touched the front brake. I hope I'm not incapable of learning
to park my bike. I'm just turning too sharply and going too slow. When it happens, it sure goes fast.

I am not writing specifically to Nighthawk here, but in general, to anyone attempting to master a big bike.

I never had a problem with turning the Nomad after the first few minutes practice, and I was hiking around a passenger with complete confidence by my third ride on it. But that's not because I'm some natural born rider or anything. I was horrible at first! I crashed the first few bikes I rode doing stupid maneuvers, and more than once too.

Instead, it's because of practice and progressive training. At first I learned to ride on fairly small bikes: 50cc then 100cc, then 150cc, 180cc, then 350cc, 450cc, 750cc, 900cc, and now 1500cc. Each time I moved up in size, I had to learn to do things a little different and a little better; but it was a steady progression over the years, and thus I had no huge hurdles to climb, and I always had plenty of confidence in what I was doing because of that. The differences were easy to master from one bike to the next by taking it in such steps. This is how all pilots, motorcycle racers, ships captains, etc. are trained, and with good reason.

Had I tried to go from the 50cc or even the 350cc directly to the 1500cc I woulda had BIG problems mastering the bike. If anybody finds even basic parking lot practice to be daunting on the Nomad-if you cant do a full lock turn in either direction from a dead stop, with a passenger, I'd advise them to step down a notch and get a smaller bike to practice on until they had it all down pat. Then tackle the Nomad.

Don't be ashamed! The Nomad is a monster! It's the Great White Whale! You're not gonna peg it on the first harpoon and you shouldn't try.

I would absolutely NOT advise you to take a bike this heavy out into traffic unless you have full confidence in your ability to maneuver it in the parking lot. If you've gotta think about it--if you've gotta think, "OK now look around over there and that far ahead, because that's where I want the bike to go."--you will NOT be able to properly focus your attention on traffic. You will not be able to avoid that pothole or that oil slick or that chihuahua that you'd normally spot peripherally; because when you're trying to focus too hard on where you need to go your peripheral vision will be worthless.

You've got to be able to focus on traffic and and see road hazards peripherally, and ride the bike without having to think about the mechanics of handling it and making it go where you want it to, before you'll be even marginally safe out on the public streets..

[racinchef]

I have to echo what CMQ is saying about the Nomad. I am a big guy at 5'11" and 260 lbs, and I am able to get my feet well planted, so when I get myself into an off balance situation I am able to muscle the bike back to where I want it, but you add to that loose footing, uneven terrain and a full-sized passenger and it is an absolute bear to get the Nomad to go where you want in tight quarters. I cannot even imagine what it can be like for those of slighter frames or our rough and tumble lady riders. No, the Nomad is a beast and it takes a confident hand with good balance to pilot her successfully.

[glwilson]

With all due respect to CaddmannQ and his years of riding experience; I still insist that practicing the "where you look" technique is essential to good riding skills. CaddmannQ has a good point about being able to see traffic; however once you have practiced this technique in turns to the point of effeciency you will find that you will not be wholly concentrating on it -- it will just become a natural skill allowing you then to concentrate on potholes; oil spots; and traffic through your peripheral view.

[csguru]

+++ What they said......

For me the problem used to be not looking into my turn or not far enough down my travel path. This used to be a big problem for me and as a matter of a fact it was the cause of the only time I had a problem on my bike (ran off the road back in the old days). I suffered from "Am I driving the bike or is the bike driving me" uncertainty so I taught myself (or so I thought) enough to think I had overcome the problem.

Due to Michigan's stupid ass insurance policies I wanted to take a MSF class to get the insurance discount so I signed up for a performance based riding class a few years ago..........That old cliche is true you can teach an old dog new tricks, after taking the course I'm more confident on my bike and now truly feel like I'm in control so I enjoy riding more.

The course has made a world of difference and highly recommend it as well as practicing what you have learned. I especially do this the beginning of the riding season or if there has been an extended absence from my riding.

[dhelfritz]

Raising the bars will give you more control of the front end. If not stopped completely, add a little throttle into the turn, this will add to your atability. Turn your head and look down the road where you want the bike to go. Do not look down in the turn, look further ahead. All of this should help your stability. Gently power into the turn.

[Top Cat]

our rough and tumble lady riders

I like that Bruce, not sure how kawgirl ,unwind2 ,anita4red ,bikerchick , dakals , dip , dlarue , and the other girls on here are gonna feel

[ells]

Originally Posted by Top Cat (TC)

our rough and tumble lady riders

I like that Bruce, not sure how kawgirl ,unwind2 ,anita4red ,bikerchick , dakals , dip , dlarue , and the other girls on here are gonna feel

I'm sure it was meant affectionately.

Still don't see where anyone has answered the original question - Why are right turn harder? I hadn't noticed that myself, other than maybe in traffic they tend to be sharper, in the the US as was mentioned