Victory and HD - Page 9

ponch · 02-09-2011, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Netnorske

Quote:

Originally Posted by ponch

When John Hoover envisioned the Vulcan, it was as a modern version of what an Indian might look and be like. The intention was not to copy HD. Well, Hoover left in 2004 and Kawasaki took a different direction. That's a shame. The 2005 Nomad was probably the last bike to have his influence.

The 1600 has the better rider triangle as compared to the HD or new 1700. All they needed to do was tighten up the steering head angle about 4-6˚, put a much better seat on it, put better brakes/abs, and about 10-15 more HP at the rear wheel. None of this would have changed the bike negatively as they have. It would seem to me that when they designed the latest, it was done from a corp perspective and they didn't get input from people that actually ride 1500/1600 Nomads, but rather divined that HD sells the most cruisers so we should be like that. JMO.

A rookie mistake no bike designer should ever make...!!!

I've never read anywhere that Kawasaki talked to anyone about what they would like changed. Focus groups? Surveys? You want to know something? After I took my test ride on the Ultra, I got invited to do a survey by HD and it was about my impression of the whole product line, what I liked, didn't like, etc. Interesting.

**taranis** · 02-09-2011, 10:05 PM

Totally agree with everything you said, Kris. Kawasaki is going after the 'bagger' market, since that's all the rage after the chopper phase died out with the economy. Thus the Vaquero. Kawasaki has cut too many corners in build quality and customer experience after the sale (if they every had it) I was really hoping to see some improvement in build quality with the bags and trunk at this year's motorcycle show, but was left disappointed yet again.

Personally, my list of replacements for when the time is up for my '06 is short. For the last two years, it's been a toss up between an '08 low-mileage Nomad or the Yamaha Roal Star Tour Deluxe. The only thing I don't particularly care for in the RSTD is the carbureted intake. Even in their 2011 model, still no fuel injection. *sigh*

My lust for the Victory Cross-Country happened quite by accident. I'm not a big fan of their design ideas - the Vision is flat-out the ugliest bike I've every laid eyes on - but the XC has just enough of that traditional cruiser look that I decided to throw a leg over.

I was very surprised at the ergonomics. It fits my 6'6" frame like a glove. Ann hopped on the pilon and leaned against the trunk's backrest and was happy too. The fact that it's a quick-detach was a huge-selling point, since Ann doesn't ride with me that much anyway. The build quality though, was the final straw. The bags are big and functional, and above all, don't feel cheaply made like the Voyager's.

The only thing that stops me from trading in the Nomad is my bank account. ::) Probably a good thing.

ndbigfish · 02-09-2011, 10:06 PM

The best design in the world without a customer base is extinct very soon. A product has to appeal to the base, i.e the "sheepeople"and we know what happens when the sheepeople start making decisions. ;)

blowndodge · 02-10-2011, 12:14 AM

I have ridden the V2K and the difference in power over the 1600 is astonishing.. I've heard the issues of short longevity of the motor but one would think it could/should have been corrected.

ponch · 02-10-2011, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blowndodge "Darksider"

I have ridden the V2K and the difference in power over the 1600 is astonishing.. I've heard the issues of short longevity of the motor but one would think it could/should have been corrected.

Big bore + Long Stroke + High Piston Speed=short life. They'd have to drop the rev limit to get the longevity. Look at the 8.1L Chevy I mean GM engine. It uses oil like a 2 stroke. Ok, not that bad, but you'd think they'd fix that too. They did...they discontinued it in production vehicles.

dank · 02-10-2011, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by schoeney

I would love to try out a sport tourer. My buddy keeps offering to let me ride his ST1300 but I am worried I would like it. ;)

Don't try it unless you are ready to change bikes!!!

**ringadingh** · 02-10-2011, 09:36 AM

Ive heard that the V2K's have oil usage problems around 30k, you would think that someone would have come out with an improved piston and ring design by now.

tombstone · 02-10-2011, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ponch

Quote:

Originally Posted by Netnorske

A rookie mistake no bike designer should ever make...!!!

I've never read anywhere that Kawasaki talked to anyone about what they would like changed. Focus groups? Surveys? You want to know something? After I took my test ride on the Ultra, I got invited to do a survey by HD and it was about my impression of the whole product line, what I liked, didn't like, etc. Interesting.

And THAT is where HD kicks every other OEMs butt, marketing and customer feedback. You don't have to build a better mousetrap, you just have to convince the buyer that it's better.

ponch · 02-10-2011, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ringadingh

Ive heard that the V2K's have oil usage problems around 30k, you would think that someone would have come out with an improved piston and ring design by now.

Thing is, I believe the bores use a nickel ceramic plating. Once that goes, it has to be replated or thrown away.

**glwilson** · 04-23-2014, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blowndodge;

You well know that if HD was losing money and the stocks price starts to tank, many of those fund managers will sell that stock in November to "window dress" their portfolios.. I bet that happened with them and no, [B

I would not want my portfolio holding their stock![/B]

If HD ever looses it's "niche" market they might die..

Sure hope no one takes your investment advice!

Seems to me HD did rather well since this post on 02/06/2011

Let's see... HOG from 4/6/2011 to 4/22/2014 +77.83% versus the S&P500TR over same period +42.49%.

Ummm... Glad I take my own investing advice BD!

**schoeney** · 04-23-2014, 04:26 PM

Man this is an old thread.

**glwilson** · 04-23-2014, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by schoeney

Man this is an old thread.

I had to save it because BD said he wouldn't own HD stock then. Just wanted to let him know I am glad he doesn't pick my investments.

skullbagger · 04-23-2014, 08:43 PM

this funny shit I dont care who you are!

02-09-2011, 10:05 PM	#122
taranis Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Grand Prairie, TX Posts: 802	Victory and HD Totally agree with everything you said, Kris. Kawasaki is going after the 'bagger' market, since that's all the rage after the chopper phase died out with the economy. Thus the Vaquero. Kawasaki has cut too many corners in build quality and customer experience after the sale (if they every had it) I was really hoping to see some improvement in build quality with the bags and trunk at this year's motorcycle show, but was left disappointed yet again. Personally, my list of replacements for when the time is up for my '06 is short. For the last two years, it's been a toss up between an '08 low-mileage Nomad or the Yamaha Roal Star Tour Deluxe. The only thing I don't particularly care for in the RSTD is the carbureted intake. Even in their 2011 model, still no fuel injection. sigh My lust for the Victory Cross-Country happened quite by accident. I'm not a big fan of their design ideas - the Vision is flat-out the ugliest bike I've every laid eyes on - but the XC has just enough of that traditional cruiser look that I decided to throw a leg over. I was very surprised at the ergonomics. It fits my 6'6" frame like a glove. Ann hopped on the pilon and leaned against the trunk's backrest and was happy too. The fact that it's a quick-detach was a huge-selling point, since Ann doesn't ride with me that much anyway. The build quality though, was the final straw. The bags are big and functional, and above all, don't feel cheaply made like the Voyager's. The only thing that stops me from trading in the Nomad is my bank account. ::) Probably a good thing. __________________ _______________________ "Taranis" and the Lovely Ann KawaNOW Oldschool #885 His: 2006 Nomad Hers: 2008 VN900 Classic LT
	0

02-09-2011, 10:06 PM	#123
ndbigfish Sr. Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: New Braunfels, Texas Posts: 1,162	Victory and HD The best design in the world without a customer base is extinct very soon. A product has to appeal to the base, i.e the "sheepeople"and we know what happens when the sheepeople start making decisions. ;) __________________ Brik VBA #1047 07 Electra Glide Ultra (43,300 & counting) 03 Nomad - 37,972 (traded 5/6/13) 99 Nomad - Only a memory since 4/27/13
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02-10-2011, 12:14 AM	#124
blowndodge Sr. Contributor Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Washington City, Utah Posts: 16,474	Victory and HD I have ridden the V2K and the difference in power over the 1600 is astonishing.. I've heard the issues of short longevity of the motor but one would think it could/should have been corrected. __________________ I love my Victory Cross Country Tour 106. Smells like Victory! Ultra's are Limited There are two types of Harley riders. Those that trailer them and those that push them. The most Interesting Man in the World "Find the things in life you don't do well and don't do those things" Member # 0005
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02-10-2011, 09:36 AM	#127
ringadingh Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Newmarket Ontario Canada Posts: 35,387	Victory and HD Ive heard that the V2K's have oil usage problems around 30k, you would think that someone would have come out with an improved piston and ring design by now. __________________ 2002 Nomad aka Bountyhunter VBA #27 VROC #18951
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04-23-2014, 04:26 PM	#131
schoeney Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: NW Region Posts: 5,222	Man this is an old thread. __________________ VBA #659 2003 Nomad 1500 (Gone but never forgotten) 2005 Honda ST1300 - Sweet and still kickin 2006 Honda Goldwing - Best Boat in the Marina
	0

04-23-2014, 08:43 PM	#133
skullbagger Advanced Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: N.C. Posts: 727	honestly though this funny shit I dont care who you are!
	0

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