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09-18-2015, 10:52 PM | #1 |
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Ballwin, MO
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Throttle Balance adjustment
Is there a procedure anywhere on the proper adjustment of the Idle air adjustment screws on the throttle body? I can not find any information on these any where.
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09-19-2015, 06:58 AM | #2 | |
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If you are talking about adjusting Air /Fuel like on a carbed bike, there is no adjustment. The bike is fuel injected and ECU controlled, therefore you would need a fuel processor like the Power Commander 5 to make adjustments for Air Fuel mix.
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2004 Vulcan 1500 Classic "Sasha" (SOLD) 2014 Vulcan Vaquero ABS SE "Candie" On the 1500, too much to list. On the Vaquero: V&H slash cut slip ons Power Commander 5 and Ivan-ized ECU Chuckster's BAK Aux Audio adapter with bluetooth receiver. Mustang 2 up Touring Seat w/ driver and passenger backrest Kuryakyn Longhorn highway pegs. Kawasaki 12 volt charger Longer 1600 meanstreak SE kickstand Full LED Daymaker light mod. |
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09-19-2015, 12:49 PM | #3 | |
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09-19-2015, 01:30 PM | #4 | |
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I looked into these and what they did back in 2011 when I had my throttle bodies off but dang I can't remember what I found out bout them. I do remember mine would not turn easily so I left them alone. RACNRAY
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"TRUE HAPPINESS IS IN THE HEART, NOT IN THE OUTSIDE FIXES" WITH OVER 46 YEARS AS A MOTORCYCLE TECHNICIAN/HI-PO SHOP OWNER I AM A PURVEYOR OF FACT NOT FICTION! "WE LIVE OUR LIVES IN CHAINS NEVER KNOWING WE HAD THE KEY" |
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09-19-2015, 04:17 PM | #5 |
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Ballwin, MO
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I've tried that, and it does idle up. however i'm having some issues witht he bike. let me detail my woes.
New bike, '14 1700 nomad 3 miles on it when i brought it home. behaved myself during break in and took to dealer to have first service done, then i started to get picky i guess(might be worth mentioning my other ride is a BMW R1100RT i brought back from the dead). my first long ride/highway ride was not very good. On interstate, the bike had no power in 5th or 6th. could not use cruze @ 65 in 5th, bike just felt like is was goin to die, not to mention the gas milage was reading around 29-31. Got to a buddy's house and messed around on the net could not find much besides spend money and install devices. Not really what i want to hear on new bike or while 200 miles from the house. messed around with idle speed(no tach on bike only calibrated ear) and could tell a difference - lowered (really bad sounding full of knocks) + raised idle. Left it set to max and started back home.bike was much better. now power in 5th (6th still stumbled) and MPG reading around 34-35. but made it home. Checked the throttle body for leaks around orings and found the three bolts a little loose. tightened and bike got a little better. while every thing was off i noticed the bypass adjustment screws which i am very familiar with since i've done all my own "SYNC""ing on the BMW. Thought same principle may apply here. thats were i was this morning. i decided to hook up my manometer and just check balance using the capped off ports at the rear of the throttle. 20150919_131307_resized.jpg 20150919_125334_resized.jpg 20150919_125723_resized.jpg Discovered the rear cylinder was pulling more vacuum, so i tweaked it and the bike seams to love it. test ride seamed much more powerful and mpg read 37-38. going to try a much longer highway run now and will post those results. now i just need to fix the wander when riding solo...... Login or Register to Remove Ads |
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09-20-2015, 08:34 AM | #6 |
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Mpg and engine smootheness will improve when you log more miles. Mine seemed to feel fully loosened up at about 4500 miles. Now at 7200 miles she is smoothe as butter, especially after changing to Synthetic oil and running the current map in my PCV. Adding a little timing advance has gone a long way.
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2004 Vulcan 1500 Classic "Sasha" (SOLD) 2014 Vulcan Vaquero ABS SE "Candie" On the 1500, too much to list. On the Vaquero: V&H slash cut slip ons Power Commander 5 and Ivan-ized ECU Chuckster's BAK Aux Audio adapter with bluetooth receiver. Mustang 2 up Touring Seat w/ driver and passenger backrest Kuryakyn Longhorn highway pegs. Kawasaki 12 volt charger Longer 1600 meanstreak SE kickstand Full LED Daymaker light mod. |
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09-20-2015, 12:21 PM | #7 |
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Marietta, GA
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Wow! No wonder it was running so bad with an imbalance like that. Balancing carbed engines is a fact of lift. I wasn't sure if there was any need on FI, but apparently there is. I'm glad I kept my homemade manometer when I got the Voyager.
Glad you found the problem and thanks for posting it. |
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09-20-2015, 07:29 PM | #8 |
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Location: Ballwin, MO
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Both screws were turned full stop from factory. I really wanted to check idle speed but my timing light would not pick up accurately.
the two ports on the back of the TB that are plugged work perfect for this test. I made 6" extension hoses so i could access them easier. I opened both up slightly 1/8 of a turn off bottom and then balanced at idle. I let the bike cool down and started it again to make sure it wouldn't have issues. Once it warmed up, I watched it while running up the RPMs. was slightly off balance on the high side (3/4 throttle+) but can not adjust that with out modification to the butterflies since they are sing shaft. I'm looking on EBAY for a pull off throttle body so i can test some theories on sensor positions. I'm surprised KAWA only answer for signal out of range is replacement of the entire TB, and the range is pretty wide open IMO. |
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09-21-2015, 02:38 PM | #9 | |
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Ponch VBA 0019 VROC 8109-R BMWMOA 162849 BMWRA 41335 BMW: When you care enough to ride the very best. My Motorrad Blog My Motorrad YouTube 2009 BMW R1200RT Previous bikes:2007 Nomad | 2001 Vulcan 800 Classic | 1984 GPz750 | 1978 KZ1000A2 Rallies: Custer '09|Prairie Du Chien '10|Crescent City '11
Last edited by ponch; 09-21-2015 at 02:47 PM.
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09-21-2015, 02:41 PM | #10 | |
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Ponch VBA 0019 VROC 8109-R BMWMOA 162849 BMWRA 41335 BMW: When you care enough to ride the very best. My Motorrad Blog My Motorrad YouTube 2009 BMW R1200RT Previous bikes:2007 Nomad | 2001 Vulcan 800 Classic | 1984 GPz750 | 1978 KZ1000A2 Rallies: Custer '09|Prairie Du Chien '10|Crescent City '11 |
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09-22-2015, 09:26 AM | #11 |
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Location: Ballwin, MO
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BMW Oilhead motors can be adjusted. every one has been fighting surging and runability issues without any help from BMW. look for zero-zero adjustments. they are not BMW sanctioned adjustments.
The system on my nomad looks to be an open loop FI system. this in reality is nothing more than an electric carb. there is no feed back from the output of the system besides RPM, and that can be modified in several ways. in order for the system to work without feedback, i.e. O2 sensor, the process must assume all inputs are true to value. also in this system there are only two point of control, fuel and throttle position. Throttle position most likely follows the accelerator position off idle while monitoring intake pressure(currently only hooked up to the rear port) and while at idle seeks out a set point based on throttle plate position and rpm feed back. Fuel will follow a predetermined logarithm following intake pressure and throttle position. with out feed back, all this works on the assumption that 2.3 volts on throttle position sensor = throttle plates at 50%. if sensor is out of adjustment then the system breaks down. This is where mass production adds in tolerances. and while in tolerance may run ok, its not ideal. |
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09-22-2015, 10:04 AM | #12 | |
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Ponch VBA 0019 VROC 8109-R BMWMOA 162849 BMWRA 41335 BMW: When you care enough to ride the very best. My Motorrad Blog My Motorrad YouTube 2009 BMW R1200RT Previous bikes:2007 Nomad | 2001 Vulcan 800 Classic | 1984 GPz750 | 1978 KZ1000A2 Rallies: Custer '09|Prairie Du Chien '10|Crescent City '11 |
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09-22-2015, 10:32 AM | #13 |
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Although Kawi recommends 90 octane many of us have found the engines run better with 89. What we have down here is 87/89/93 and not only with the 1700's but many sportbikes (most with 12-1 c.r.) run better with 89 than with 93. The feedback I get from 1700 owners (from around the country) have positive results when they have switched from the higher octane to 89. Better performance, mpg and many report less decel popping on skoots with that occurring.
1700's with exhaust mods, a good BAK and proper FI tuning can run 87 with no problems. The 1700 is a mild engine, 9.5-1 c.r., a good spark plug design (although Kawi should of stayed with dual plug heads like on the 1500/1600). In the first few thousand miles I experimented with octane, first runnin 93. On the first tank of 89 the engine ran noticeable smoother, a tiny bit better throttle response and about 4 tenths better mpg. Ran 89 for awhile then switched to 87. No pinging and no change in anything other than saving some $$$ at the pump. RACNRAY
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"TRUE HAPPINESS IS IN THE HEART, NOT IN THE OUTSIDE FIXES" WITH OVER 46 YEARS AS A MOTORCYCLE TECHNICIAN/HI-PO SHOP OWNER I AM A PURVEYOR OF FACT NOT FICTION! "WE LIVE OUR LIVES IN CHAINS NEVER KNOWING WE HAD THE KEY" |
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09-22-2015, 11:32 AM | #14 | |
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__________________
Ponch VBA 0019 VROC 8109-R BMWMOA 162849 BMWRA 41335 BMW: When you care enough to ride the very best. My Motorrad Blog My Motorrad YouTube 2009 BMW R1200RT Previous bikes:2007 Nomad | 2001 Vulcan 800 Classic | 1984 GPz750 | 1978 KZ1000A2 Rallies: Custer '09|Prairie Du Chien '10|Crescent City '11 |
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09-27-2015, 11:48 AM | #15 | |
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Location: Ottawa, Canada
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I'd be hesitant in doing that. My Canadian bike had a nice sticker beside the fuel cap: 91 Octane only, or "severe engine damage will result". Do our 1700s not have a knock sensor? |
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