Kawwy should make a....

[andyvh1959]

How about a new Mean Streak Vaquero? Kawasaki knows how to make power, and long ago the Mean Streak was kind of a power cruiser, before the likes of the Yamaha 1800 and Honda 1800. Yet Kawwy never made a power V-twin to really challenge them, much less go after Harley and Indian. Now Harley has the Revolution V-twin (which is similar in engine architecture to many Japanese V-twin engines). Kawwy could make a real V-twin power engine, and make a new Mean Streak Vaquero.

Now that Harley has the Revolution V-twin in the Panamerica making 150hp stock, and peak torque of 94 ft-lb, they have a water cooled engine similar in architecture to the Indian water cooled v-twin. But much less displacement and torque than the Indian. Makes one wonder if Harley would produce a big bore Revolution V-twin to beat Indian at the game.

https://vtwinvisionary.com/harley-re...ngine-details/

Interesting that after 20 some years of the metric cruisers copying Harley with their interpretations of the big V-twin, Harley now produces a water cooled V-twin very similar in architecture to the metric V-twins of the last 20 years. In comparison to the Revolution V-twin, the Kawasaki 1600 Classic is a 50 degree V-twin, has 4-valve heads, 102mm bore and 95mm stroke, overhead cam, water cooled, two throttle bodies, but only 9:1 comp ratio. As such it has some design similarities to the Revolution engine. But the Harley engine is much more built for power and rpm, 60 degree V-twin, 105mm bore and 72mm stroke, 13:1 comp ratio, better breathing, variable valve timing and more.

I bet if Kawasaki wanted to, they could build a REAL Mean Streak V-twin engine to challenge the likes of Indian and Harley, but where is the market for that type of a new engine and bike. Indian and Harley, even Yamaha and Honda already have that covered. But a new 1800 Mean Streak, with a new V-twin making at least 150 hp would be interesting. Kawasaki knows how to make big power in engines.

[BrokeAss]

I owned a 2004 MeanStreak from new to 31k miles. Good bike with excellent brakes and handling for an 8ft long cruiser. Even the 1700cc engine with belt drive and an aluminum frame a la Yamaha Warrior would've made for an awesome 2009 MeanStreak. Alas, the demand just isn't there as even the Classic and Nomad received the axe. Time will tell if basic stripped cruisers will ever make a comeback, assuming the WEF permits private vehicle ownership much longer.

[MAS Tequila]

Just go buy an Indian Scout with the 100 HP engine.

You'll forget all about the Meanies.

[redjay]

Originally Posted by MAS Tequila

Just go buy an Indian Scout with the 100 HP engine.

You'll forget all about the Meanies.

Or buy a 1300 V Star and get Ivans ECU flash and an aftermarket intake.

Then you have an 84hp cruiser (or Tourer) for around $6000.

[andyvh1959]

Agreed. I like the Scout engine, have ridden the bike and its a great platform, but the Scout looks do nothing for me at all. The Victory Octane was a much better looking bike than the Scout. Too bad Polaris axed Victory because many of their platforms were great bikes, great engines. If I had found a Victory Kingpin 106 for near the same price I found my 1600 Classic it would have been a no brainer. I really liked the Kingpin because it did embody many aspects of a power cruiser. Being a "discontinued" bike wouldn't bother me at all, I do all my won work anyway.

Dealer where I used to work part time even had a Stage 3 built Kingpin, that was a hoot to ride, loved to rev, easy power delivery but surprising when you wanted it. The engine and power surpassed the chassis and brakes. Both of those could be easily updated with swapping factory parts.

[alwhite00]

Ma Kaw needs a new Voyager. They still make it but quit making any accessories for them. That is an old platform.

[andyvh1959]

Yamaha, Honda, Harley and Indian all make large bore V-twins with a good bit more power than the 1700 produces. If Ma Kaw wants to still have a bit of the big cruiser market she is far behind the competition. Sure the 1700 can get the boosts from Ivan and aftermarket pipes, etc, but really the 1700 needs to be updated.

I recently rented an Indian Pursuit to ride the Twisted Sisters in Texas. The Pursuit is a 912 lb big bike, but it handles easily, and makes GOBs of power stock; 124 hp and 129 ft lb of torque. And it likes to spin the revs easily. Smooth power, very little if any vibes, but, the heat cooking my right calf was significant. Now, it was near 95F on the ride, but I had the lower vents open and I could still really feel the heat.

Up here in east central Wisconsin right now would be great for riding in early to late fall.

[BrokeAss]

Originally Posted by andyvh1959

Yamaha, Honda, Harley and Indian all make large bore V-twins with a good bit more power than the 1700 produces.

Honda? In what? Biggest V-twin they still offer is the 1300cc Fury. Harley and Yamaha are air-cooled (that's a big 'no' from me) and Indians are hella expensive. The Kaws are excellent value and make damn good power with the flash, intake and pipes.

[andyvh1959]

Oh, right, the 1800 Honda is no more. That Fury looks to be a useless bike to me, likewise the 1300 Interstate. I just don't like the front wheel kicked way out there like an attempt to be a factory chopper. Air cooled engines aren't bad, I'd consider a Yamaha Eluder or an Indian Chieftain. I've ridden the Indian Pursuit for six hours and MAN did it pump serious heat onto my right calf even with the lower vents open.

[ldhthept]

The Meanie was a great sports cruiser, liked having my feet out in front of me and could ride all day. The Scout has a great water cooled engine but unless it was bobbed the looks were suspect and I felt like I was sitting on it instead of in it if you know what I mean.

[andyvh1959]

Yeah, I have ridden the Scout and loved the engine, loved the tight responsive feel of the chassis, just do not care for the Bobber look. To me the fat front tire/wheel, the clipped front fender (I know, a Bobber is supposed to look that way), the way too long fat mufflers detract from the center proportions of the chassis. The Indian Scout is basically what the Victory Octane was with different bodywork.

To me the Victory Octane is what Kawwy could shoot for with a brand new meaner Mean Streak. Kawwy knows how to build a very strong engine and chassis. Here is a Victory Octane with a much better looking exhaust setup than the stock Octane or Indian Scout. Kawwy body styling on a bike like this Octane would be killer:

[ponch]

Kawasaki hasn't made any changes since 2009 when the 1700 was introduced. Long in tooth doesn't even describe it.

The revolution is a different engine as is the PA. There are other choices besides Indian. Ducati, BMW and Moto Guzzi make twins that have stonk, handle and stop well too.

I don't see Kawasaki updating the big twins. They probably don't sell many of them and don't see it as a worthwhile investment. HD and Indian seem to be doing ok even considering the entry price and Honda has the GW which does well too. I think Kawasaki missed some opportunities, but it's past and like a lot of folks here, I moved on and I probably will never go back unless they make something compelling, which I doubt.

[BrokeAss]

Originally Posted by ponch

Kawasaki hasn't made any changes since 2009 when the 1700 was introduced. Long in tooth doesn't even describe it.

The revolution is a different engine as is the PA. There are other choices besides Indian. Ducati, BMW and Moto Guzzi make twins that have stonk, handle and stop well too.

I don't see Kawasaki updating the big twins. They probably don't sell many of them and don't see it as a worthwhile investment. HD and Indian seem to be doing ok even considering the entry price and Honda has the GW which does well too. I think Kawasaki missed some opportunities, but it's past and like a lot of folks here, I moved on and I probably will never go back unless they make something compelling, which I doubt.

Why would they invest R&D dollars on a dying segment? The Nomad and Classic were axed because they weren't selling, not because they were obsolete tech. A proper cruiser shouldn't need bluetooth and a TFT screen to be relevant. Honda dropped the VTX line, Suzuki pared down the Boulevard lineup, Harley eliminated a lot of their not-really-a-whole-new-model models...it's a segment wide decrease in sales/interest met with less development and fewer choices. Maybe cruisers will come back some day but for now bikes like the MT-01 are what's selling to a younger buyer not yet genocided by Remdesivir during our recent scamdemic.

[alwhite00]

Originally Posted by andyvh1959

Agreed. I like the Scout engine, have ridden the bike and its a great platform, but the Scout looks do nothing for me at all. The Victory Octane was a much better looking bike than the Scout. Too bad Polaris axed Victory because many of their platforms were great bikes, great engines. If I had found a Victory Kingpin 106 for near the same price I found my 1600 Classic it would have been a no brainer. I really liked the Kingpin because it did embody many aspects of a power cruiser. Being a "discontinued" bike wouldn't bother me at all, I do all my won work anyway.

Dealer where I used to work part time even had a Stage 3 built Kingpin, that was a hoot to ride, loved to rev, easy power delivery but surprising when you wanted it. The engine and power surpassed the chassis and brakes. Both of those could be easily updated with swapping factory parts.

I went from a 1500 nomad and bought a Victory Cross Country Tour and absolutely love this bike. I threw cams and an air filter on it, had it dyno tuned and got 110hp / 117tq at the rear wheel. A TON more power than my Nomad.

[ldhthept]

Living in Florida I am really stuck on having a water cooled engine, I like the baggers and not ready to stop riding. GW, BMW, Moto Guzi, Ducati way too pricey and no one close works on them.