Electrical Question

[taranis]

I'm trying to figure out the schematic for wiring in a relay, and I think I've almost got it, except for one thing. See the example diagram here:

http://www.gadgetjq.com/fuse_block_switched_2.jpg

In the example above, they're wiring in driving lights. I'm going to assume this is a 12v negative ground set up like my truck is. So + is hot, "-" is ground. Right? So that also means post 87 is "+".. yes?

In the actual process of wiring in driving lights, for example, what would be the best place to wire in the ground? Run the "-" all the way back to the battery? Or does it just depend on the application? Ground to the frame? Black/Yellow wire? If I were to start splicing negative leads into any black/yellow wire on the bike, what does that do to the load on the electrical system? Or am I shaggin' up a tree without my nuts?

There's actually a purpose to my confusion, and method to my madness. Right now I have a 12v socket wired into the headlight bucket. I use it for my Garmin and it works great. But I'd like it to shut off when the bike is off - hence the relay. And if I'm gonna do all this work, I might as well put in a fuse box too, for when the time comes to upgrade my horn.

The ironic thing is, after I get the fuse box and relay installed, I won't know how to wire in my horn anyway. :-/ Since there's two wires going to the horn and the postive going to the fuse box, I'd be sitting on the garage floor wondering what I'm supposed to do with the other wire. Ground it to the frame.. maybe? Gah....

Someone enlighten me before I go stark ravin' mad...

[Yellow Jacket]

What kind of fuse block do you have? Does it have switched and unswitched fuses or just switched? How many connections are on the fuse block? BAT, PWR and GND?

If the fuse block has ground positions those would be a good place to ground accessories like driving lights or the horn. Any close frame ground would be OK too, like the bolts holding the engine guards on. I wouldn't splice any high amperage accessory like a Stebel horn to a black/yellow wire. Most of those wires are only rated for 10 amps.

[cactusjack]

Haha, I drew that schematic diagram.

Unless the device is something critical like an ECM, I would just ground to the nearest good ground location, or to the fuse block if it is equipped with a ground post. No need to run it all the way back to the negative battery post.

[taranis]

I haven't bought a fuse block or relay yet. I'm just trying to figure out the process and how it all works so I can be a little more informed when I head to the parts store for the relay and fuse block. All accessory connections to the fuse block will be switched, I'm probably looking at getting a 4-connection block, since I have no need for unswitched connections or more than four of unswitched.

If the fuse block has a ground post, then is the best connection for that ground post the negative terminal of the battery? Sounds like anywhere solid to the frame would be a good choice.

BAT, PWR and GND? Aw crap. How is it hooked up to the relay in that configuration? BAT and PWR are the same thing in my mind. Is BAT unswitched "+" and PWR switched "+"?

That still leaves me with how to hook up a Stebel or any aftermarket two-post horn using the fuse box. I've looked at Gadget's site, where he shows the schematic with a relay. (http://www.gadgetjq.com/airhorn_wiring_diagram.jpg)

That makes sense, sort of. But if I install a fuse block, what wire goes where? I've been staring at both these schematics for 1/2 an hour and I can't figure it out.

[cactusjack]

Originally Posted by Taranis

I haven't bought a fuse block or relay yet. I'm just trying to figure out the process and how it all works so I can be a little more informed when I head to the parts store for the relay and fuse block. All accessory connections to the fuse block will be switched, I'm probably looking at getting a 4-connection block, since I have no need for unswitched connections or more than four of unswitched.

If the fuse block has a ground post, then is the best connection for that ground post the negative terminal of the battery? Sounds like anywhere solid to the frame would be a good choice.

BAT, PWR and GND? Aw crap. How is it hooked up to the relay in that configuration? BAT and PWR are the same thing in my mind. Is BAT unswitched "+" and PWR switched "+"?

That still leaves me with how to hook up a Stebel or any aftermarket two-post horn using the fuse box. I've looked at Gadget's site, where he shows the schematic with a relay. (http://www.gadgetjq.com/airhorn_wiring_diagram.jpg)

That makes sense, sort of. But if I install a fuse block, what wire goes where? I've been staring at both these schematics for 1/2 an hour and I can't figure it out.

Well, the terminal block pictured in that diagram is a very basic one. You connect your hot wire (switched or not) to the post then just connect the positive lead from whatever devices you want to power to the spade terminals and insert the appropriate fuse.

The diagram shows how to hook up an accessory fuse block so it is switched, hence the relay. Leave out the relay and connect it straight to the battery and it's always on. There is no provision to provide both switched and constant power on a block like that. It must be one or the other. There are fuse blocks with 2 power inputs that can provide both modes of power. I have one of those between the forks on my bike to provide switches power for driving lights and my cruise control and constant power for my 12v accessory outlet and GPS cable.

Here's an example of a more sophisticated fuse block. It's the same thing I have:
http://www.cyclenutz.com/products/el...use_panel.html

[taranis]

Originally Posted by cactusjack

Well, the terminal block pictured in that diagram is a very basic one. You connect your hot wire (switched or not) to the post then just connect the positive lead from whatever devices you want to power to the spade terminals and insert the appropriate fuse.

The diagram shows how to hook up an accessory fuse block so it is switched, hence the relay. Leave out the relay and connect it straight to the battery and it's always on. There is no provision to provide both switched and constant power on a block like that. It must be one or the other. There are fuse blocks with 2 power inputs that can provide both modes of power. I have one of those between the forks on my bike to provide switches power for driving lights and my cruise control and constant power for my 12v accessory outlet and GPS cable.

Here's an example of a more sophisticated fuse block. It's the same thing I have:
http://www.cyclenutz.com/products/el...use_panel.html

Yeah, I don't need anything nearly that sophisticated. Got a riding buddy of mine here at work that helped me figure the horn installation out. Basically, fuse block or not, I still need a dedicated relay for the horn. If using a fuse block, the fuse block will power the "+" side of the horn, or I can just tap the "+" lead in the stock horn wires, following Gadget's schematic and wire in the relay from there.

[clayton]

Originally Posted by Taranis

I'm trying to figure out the schematic for wiring in a relay, and I think I've almost got it, except for one thing. See the example diagram here:

http://www.gadgetjq.com/fuse_block_switched_2.jpg

In the example above, they're wiring in driving lights. I'm going to assume this is a 12v negative ground set up like my truck is. So + is hot, "-" is ground. Right? So that also means post 87 is "+".. yes?

In the actual process of wiring in driving lights, for example, what would be the best place to wire in the ground? Run the "-" all the way back to the battery? Or does it just depend on the application? Ground to the frame? Black/Yellow wire? If I were to start splicing negative leads into any black/yellow wire on the bike, what does that do to the load on the electrical system? Or am I shaggin' up a tree without my nuts?

There's actually a purpose to my confusion, and method to my madness. Right now I have a 12v socket wired into the headlight bucket. I use it for my Garmin and it works great. But I'd like it to shut off when the bike is off - hence the relay. And if I'm gonna do all this work, I might as well put in a fuse box too, for when the time comes to upgrade my horn.

The ironic thing is, after I get the fuse box and relay installed, I won't know how to wire in my horn anyway. :-/ Since there's two wires going to the horn and the postive going to the fuse box, I'd be sitting on the garage floor wondering what I'm supposed to do with the other wire. Ground it to the frame.. maybe? Gah....

Someone enlighten me before I go stark ravin' mad...

Hey T
Thats the same instructions I followed...
87 is the hot (+) off of the fuse block.
I selected to ground my lights using the bolts that hold on the ignition coils on each side. There for not running the ground all the way back to the battery.
Then I ran the lights hot wires (+) to one of the fuse connectors on the fuse block.
I wanted to be able to have the option to turn the fog lights on and off as I felt needed so I personally put a switch in like the diagram shows.
When it was all done and said I tucked it all away within the area behind the left side cover.
Once I get the nice driving lights I saw in my other post I will be wiring those to stay on full time via the fuse block without the use of a on/off switch.
So far so good...

[taranis]

Yeah, I'm kinda/sorta debating whether to install a fuse block at all now. Simply running one relay for the horn on a 20a fuse, and another for the 12v socket sounds a heck of a lot easier, and less expensive.

On the other hand, with the fuse block installed on it's own 30a fused relay, I have a central source to run both the horn and the 12v socket, although the horn will still have to have it's own, dedicated 20a relay. This is probably the way I'll go, since it seems safer to my uneducated mind.

Now if it'd only warm up enough where I could stand being in the garage for more than 10 minutes!

[clayton]

I hear ya on the warm weather...its 22 outside where I live.
Honestly I think I invested about $25 bucks in the fuse block, relay, electric connectors and some heat shrink tube.
I had most of the wire needed and some split loom laying around the house.
For the most part your looking at taking the seats off and propping up your gas tank so you can run the wires from the battery and "doing the circuit" hehe....
I honestly think with going this route you will have a dedicated power source and the option to add without too much messing around at a later date.
If I get out to the shed today I will take some pics of how I did mine and another option for multiple connections from the battery itself.
Heck when I wired my house electric it was easy compared to how I felt about doing something to my bike that I might regret.
Once I was done I was happy with the results.
see ya

[taranis]

Man, that'd be awesome if you had some good pics. I'm just going to take the tank off altogether when I do this, since it only take about 5 minutes. Three minutes if my fingers aren't frozen.

[Yellow Jacket]

I recommend the Eastern Beaver PC-8 fuse block and their 30 Amp Relay kit.

Hard to find anything better or easier to hook up using their kit.

Check it out here. Also click on the Installation page link for good photos of hooking it up.

http://www.easternbeaver.com/Main/Pr...PC-8/pc-8.html

[clayton]

OK T
I have some pics for you to check out.
Instead of placing them here I just put the link to the album, they are named in order (Nomad-Electric1...ect)
Hope this helps man...

http://s165.photobucket.com/albums/u...ad%20electric/

...I see an error already...I reference 2 different inline fuses for #30 on the replay. It should be 20amp not 30amp.
Also the "multi-taps" I reference can be found at most automotive stores. I found mine at Pep Boys.
..I also mis-spelled desided...it should be decided....errrr fat fingers I guess :)

[taranis]

Clayton, that is outstanding! Looks like a good setup you have going there. Thanks very much for posting them!

Since it's about 32 degrees and snowing at my house, won't be doing any work on the bike soon. But you've given me a couple of pretty good ideas on how to set this stuff up - really like the multi-tap idea if I should ever need it.

[rewindgy]

Try: http://www.youtube.com/watch?vzFNowqUIY60
This sgould explain everything.

[taranis]

Originally Posted by Yellow Jacket

I recommend the Eastern Beaver PC-8 fuse block and their 30 Amp Relay kit.

Hard to find anything better or easier to hook up using their kit.

Check it out here. Also click on the Installation page link for good photos of hooking it up.

http://www.easternbeaver.com/Main/Pr...PC-8/pc-8.html

That looks like a very solid kit, but also very expensive. $85? Yikes. It's also overkill for what I need to do. But the install pictures were a great explanation of how to go about the installation.

Thank you for the link!